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I just cannot understand how could Willow forgive Harmony for kidnappings her as a baby, lying to her all her life, making fake birth certificate s for her, putting her in the cult, giving her to Shiloh to rape, arranging multiple rapes of other women in the cult, and lying to everybody that she changed while she kept a huge secret for which she killed at least 2 people. Willow forgave all of this. But Nina telling Wiley about his birth mother is unforgivable? I don't see any logic in this.
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Harmony is dead. What's the point of hating her? Also, she never tried to F with Wiley, and Nina is entirely about screwing that kid up to the point that he's as psychotic as she is. Harmony at least kept her distance from Wiley, and tried to communicate respectfully with Willow as much as she was able.
If my mother murdered a heap of people in order to keep Nina out of my life, I'd thank her too.-
Let see Nina harassed Willow to not even think about Michael because he was for Sasha in Nina’s crazy mind.
Nina bullied and had her fired from the teacher position.
Nina had a hand on Shiloh finding out about Jonah.
All this when she had already gotten treatment for her mental instability.
So all this … she did on her “right mind”
Harmony easily influenced and brainwashed believe in a creep no defense there. She then did worse crimes to cover past crimes.
But how can people say Nina is not bad. If Nina didn’t kill Silas or Ava it was out of pure luck. However, Nina did kill Rafe so there’s that.
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Simple: Willow loved Harmony.
Yes, she was angry with her and hurt when she learned the truth. But she still loved her as the only mother she ever knew.
Harmony, stayed back, allowed Willow to make the first (and second and third) move(s) and asked permission.
They were attmepting and succeeding at rebuilding their bond until Harmony's past was about to be exposed, and Harmony was afraid her daughter would leave her for good. Harmony did not force herself or impose herself on Willow post DoD.
Nina, on the other hand, has tried every trick in the book with manipulation of Willow and others to get Michael to bend. Willow realized the manipulation and called Nina on her behavior, which made Nina her enemy.
This issue is respect at this point. Nina has none, despite all her words, her actions betray her.Comment
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Willow only forgave Harmony because for once in Harmony's life, she did the right thing when she told the truth about Shiloh. This gave Willow the hope that Harmony may be turning her life around, which it did appear that way when Harmony was working at Spring Ridge and was helping Alexis. Another thing is that Harmony, for the most part, stayed out of Wiley's business, she didn't do anything to go against Millow in terms of Wiley. If Millow had known what Harmony was up to, I'm sure they would've revaluated the situation. However, Nina was given chance after chance with Millow, and all they asked of her was too not mention Nelle, which is completely reasonable because Wiley is a toddler who just learned to speak not to long ago, so how does such a young child understand something so complex and complicated. When Michael had enough of Nina, she resorted to speaking with Willow and gaining her sympathy, which Willow just ended up paying the price for. On top of that, Nina was the one who told Harmony that she was such a changed and good person and that Willow was being a saint and a snob for not forgiving her. I guess Nina forgot the part where Willow was assaulted by a grown man due to harmony, but then again, she didn't mind making the same comments towards Bobby. Nina is starting to become unstable, and instead of getting better and working to improve the mistakes she made, she is making herself look worse, so for Wiley's sake, I think Millow are doing a good job by keeping Nina away for now.Comment
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chebbo Again, nope. Nina made a face when Michael and Willow referred to Willow as "Mommy." A few minutes later Nina was left alone with Wiley. The first thing she did was say to Wiley "I'm your grandma but I'm not your mommy Willow's mommy." We never say Wiley ask anything. Not even in response to Nina's utterly uninvited introduction of the topic.
Nina claimed she was just "answering Wiley's question." But we never saw that happened. And *IF* Wiley did ask anything on the topic, it was because Nina brought the subject up. And *IF* he asked a question, there was no reason to use the terms "real mommy" and "not real mommy." The kid had 2 dads for the first 16 months of his life. "Other mommy" would have been enough if she said anything. -
rkm137 Exactly! I remember Nina making an angry face when she saw that Willow was calling herself mommy. Nina didn't like that so when she had private time with Wiley, she started saying, "I'm your grandma, but not Willow's mother, I am your real mommy's mommy". After that, Wiley went up to Willow confused and said that Nina told him she wasn't his real mommy. I remember that Nina smirked at Willow like she was proud of herself for hurting Willow's feelings. This is just one of the many reasons why Millow are trying to block Nina from seeing Wiley for the moment.
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Forgiveness is a very personal and controversial decision!
It isn't easily understood and just as easily judged!
People who forgive the perceived unforgivable are considered weak and doormats!
People who don't forgive the perceived forgivable are considered hard hearted, cold and callous!
It really is a personal, individual decision and some people are just so emotionally vulnerable that they just have the capacity to forgive what is seemingly unforgivable!
I tell you it takes a real inner strength to go against what is expected and do the unthinkable even if you're hated for doing so!
Also just because you forgive doesn't mean you accept the behavior or will ever forget!Last edited by Kristabell; May 26, 2022, 01:09 PM.Comment
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I agree with you. Its very personal. Even with viewers. Some forgive Nina everything she's done, and don't forgive Harmony for letting her "beloved" daughter to be raped. I would never ever forgive this. Other's can never forgive Nina that she told Wiley about his birth mother. In my opinion, its nothing. Or they hate Nina for not telling Carly about Sonny in NF. I say he did not want to search for his family, others say Nina kept him. We all have different opinions. And thats good.
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GH never got into Willow’s childhood not like Nelle’s.
Now they are sort of … Willow always felt second to Harmony’s wish to find a purpose. However there were moments like Colorado that Willow was Harmony’s whole world.
Willow also had a father that we know very little of, but from the little we do know he loved her.
DOD happened when Willow was 18.
DOD brainwashed people I can see how Willow would believe her mother was also brainwashed if up until that point she was loved.
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Honestly, I don't really think Willow's had time to process the "mom stole me and murdered two men to cover it up" part yet.
It's one thing to have accepted the chaotic childhood and what was done to her ( Shiloh, sex trafficking). It's another to realize the pain Madeline and Harmony inflicted on Nina. Or that Willow lost her chance to know both Silas and Kiki because of it.Comment
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Willow has believed her entire life that Harmony was her mother. You don't just shut off those feelings of love for your mother just because you find out something about her that you had no idea about. If Harmony were alive, I'm sure that Willow would have some choice words for her mother, but she can't confront her mother. Parents and children can always forgive each other, and for Willow, Harmony IS her mother. As for Nina, Willow' relationship with Nina has always been contentious since they first met. There is a history of animosity between them, and so I can easily see why Willow doesn't like her, and she has seen how manipulative Nina is to get what she wants. Also, as far as Nina knows, she has no relation to Nina, and therefore, has no conflicted feelings regarding her either.Originally posted by Fightcrab View PostComment
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Harmony hurt her, Nina hurt her child and yes Wiley is her child in every single way that matters. As a mother I have no trouble seeing why Willow is more upset about her child being hurt. Nina has never been anything but a massive bully to Willow.Shelly, Moderator
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How sad it is that we give up on people who are just like us.- Mr. Rogers.Comment
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I think that with Willow, she is compartmentalizing the bad, being told that her being raped is an honor, lying about her birth was an act of love, and the rest happened to other people.
Willow never fully grieved the loss of her own baby (minus that one heartbreaking scene that KM acted out so well), and grabbed onto the fantasy of mommihood with this surrogate baby, who is now her child legally. Nina truthfully answering the child's question 'how are we related' seemed to tap into an insecurity about her 'not being the real mommy,' when in fact an adoptive mother is a real mommy. She is striking back at Nina for tapping into that insecurity, and of course she is hugely egged on by Michael and Carly, who only see things in black and white.
In time, Willow will also remember that she'd have never had the opportunity to become Wiley's mommy if not for Nina's testimony against Nelle. She'd forgiven Nina for her previous diatribes that got her fired long ago, and I think that as Willow grows and is less insecure, that she will forgive Nina for being honest in answering Wiley's question, as well. It's all so artificial anyway. That child was practically non-verbal at the time and only two, yet we are supposed to believe that he asked an abstract question about relationships. If he asked it today, I'd accept it, but back then, it was so contrived and unbelievable.
What's happening today is just what's called foreplay in soaps. It's the hate before the great love.Comment
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Willow is still in denial about all the terrible things Harmony did because her death was so recent.
Forgiving the dead is also easier than forgiving the living, because the living are right there in your face pissing you the heck off.
I said "heck" because Willow seems like a person who'd keep a swear jar and turn herself in by putting money in it.Comment
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I think people need to try to understand when they go on about how WIllow and Michael can forgive the people who raised but not Nina is that Nina is NOTHING to them. Nina is basically a stranger who has done nothing but make their lives hell. That is not the same as being raised by someone, growing up loving someone and being hurt by them. The deep feelings of love and the good time memories are ingrained in them therefore making forgiveness more likely , they do not have that with Nina.
Just because someone forgives their parents for messed up stuff does not mean they have to forgive everyone who hurts them, that is ridiculous.
Last edited by AnotherSonnyKid; May 26, 2022, 01:54 PM.Comment
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MIchael and Willow tried to incorporate Nina into Wylie's life. That is a fact.
It is a fact that Nina betrayed the one parenting request - and she has not apologized for it.
It is a fact that NIna is retcon's Nelle into a person she was not, but the person Nina wants her to be.
Michael and Willow have concerns about a person they barely know telling tall tales (that Nelle was a wonderful person, if NIna had a chance to raise her) to their young son, taking that responsibility away from them, and in their time. I totally understand where M&W are coming from. It is a breach of trust. -
To Michael - Nina is nothing but the lunatic who gaslit his father - and is ACTIVELY destroying their family.
To Willow - Nina is her bully, her abuser, and the woman who has undermined her as a teacher - and now as a mother.
Michael and Willow have a strong secure forever bond with Wiley now - and they love him with all of their hearts -
Fightcrab So what if she is Wiley's grandmother? She is still nothing to Michael and Willow compared to the people who raised them.
Wiley is their son and they love him. Just because Nina is nothing to them does not mean they cant love their child, that is ridiculous.
By the way I could careless if she sees the kid or not, I am sick of hearing about him.
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That is one of Willow's great qualities - the ability to forgive. In spite of everything Harmony did, Willow still looked for the goodness and the ability to change. It would be OTT of Willow not to eventually forgive Nina for all she has done. I think if a rift occurs between Michael and Willow, it will be over that.Comment
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Because Harmony was her mother, at least to her. She raised her. Willow loved her. She had good times with Harmony. Nina is no one to her. Willow never loved Nina. She never had any good times with this woman. Who someone is to you makes a big difference when it comes to forgiveness. I would forgive a family member before I’d forgive a stranger, even if the family member did something much worse than the stranger.Comment
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She is nothing at all to Willow. They are in no way, shape, or form family, at least not that they know of. Willow’s only history with Nina is bad. Nina is not entitled to anything from Willow. -
Fightcrab AS of now, Nina is a stranger/outsider vis-a-vis Willow and that is who were talking about. Being biologically related to Wiley is a fact of science unless and until the related emotions are developed. And, when it comes to forgiveness, it is emotions that matter far more than facts.
This will still apply when Willow learns that Nina is her biological mother. It won't flip a switch for Willow instantly imbuing there relationship with parental and filial love. Knowing Nina is her mother *might* lead to Willow coming to terms first with how to accept that information and then forgiveness. But as of now, a series of unlikely events lead to a very unpleasant woman Willow already disliked being linked to Willow's adopted son though DNA. Willow's feelings will not change on such information.
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