Reply With QuoteParmalee could have been Jock or he could not have been. He said he was not Jock to Miss Ellie and ultimately they found evidence that he wasn't but many still believe he was. This storyline was in the 80's, not the 90's.
Recurring Poster
I have a question Does anyone remember the storyline during the 10th where Wes Parmalee was supposedly Jock Ewing? If anyone remembers this storyline do you think Wes Parmalee was Jock Ewing? I believe he was suppose to be Jock Ewing but the writers for some reason (fan reaction?) decided against it, He passed an x-ray exam and a lie detector test. I remember bobby coming back from South America with some crap story about him being someone else, who was on the helicopter with Jock that crashed in South America. They had some crazy explanation like jock had been sick with a fever or something in South America and rambled on for days about his life. I always questioned if he was sick with a fever and rambled how did that other person know his story was real ? Also Wes parmalee was not young he would have had to have been Jock’s age in order for him to remember what Jock told him he would had to have a very good memory to remember the stuff Jock said after all those years. Now of course JR and Bobby would have said he could look up the information In fact I believe that was mentioned I think, but there were some things he couldn’t have looked up even though in the storyline his memory was suppose to be not all intact. I think at the Ewing barbecue where he came to talk to Miss Ellie he either lied to her and said he wasn’t Jock or he said he didn’t mean to come back and tear the family apart and told her he was leaving for good.fyi- Some of this is a little fuzzy to me because I was a still in my Teens but I watched the it on DVD someone had about a year or so ago.
Last edited by author588; 02-01-2012 at 07:09 PM.
Board Regular
Parmalee could have been Jock or he could not have been. He said he was not Jock to Miss Ellie and ultimately they found evidence that he wasn't but many still believe he was. This storyline was in the 80's, not the 90's.
Soap Addict
The original character was Ben Stivers in the 'dream season'.....that storyline was supposed to bring Jock back to life in the form of Steve Forrest.....then Patrick Duffy decided to return to the role of Bobby Ewing...and the 'dream' concept was born....the writers, though they tried to introduce Steve Forrest once again as Wes Parmalee, ultimately decided that one 'back from the dead' (even though it was a dream that he died) character in a season was enough...therefore Parmalee was found to be a fraud who had been with Jock before he died and knew a lot of details about his life from Jock's feverish ramblings......
I wish they had made him Jock.....that would have thrown the Ellie/Clayton marriage into major turmoil and ownership of Ewing Oil would have reverted back to Jock and the status it was in before his will was put into probate...no death means no will being carried out.....
Another storyline I wish they had considered was doing something more with Amanda, Jock's first wife....and introducing another Ewing son, or even a daughter, that Jock could have fathered with Amanda...the character would have been a little older than J.R., but could have brought a major new Ewing character to the fold.....and given J.R. a rival even more ruthless than he was....
Recurring Poster
Originally Posted by Cliff Barnes
You are correct I was thinking that Dallas a reached 1990 by the time this storyline occurred.
I am not sure why so many people believe that Wes Parmelee was Jock, I can only speak for myself, but there was not real definite proof that Wes was not Jock. There was the just that shabby story that bobby (who along with JR would have never believed he was Jock no matter what it seemed) came back and told everyone not that he (bobby) was lying about the story it just made no sense. There may have been another person on the helicopter with Jock and Punk.
What I would have like to have seen or someone suggest was a DNA test involving Bobby and JR ( I think that was available in the 80’s). Also ask him (Wes) more questions about what he remembers and who (Gary Ewing? Etc. Jock couldn’t have told him his whole life story.
Recurring Poster
This probably is what happened
The thing about Wes knowing a lot of details because of Jock’s Feverish ramblings is how did Wes know if Jock story was real and not just a story of a sick man and how he remember those things. Although I guess he could read about some of the stuff somewhere and pieced together what he was told he couldn’t fake those x-rays though.
Soap Addict
Several of the storylines from 'the dream season' got sacrificed to bring Patrick Duffy back to the show...
- Ben Stivers/Wes Parmalee turned out to be a fraud
- Jamie Ewing didn't perish via the car bomb
- Mark Grayson was still 'presumed dead'
- Ray and Donna were not adopting a deaf boy
- Sue Ellen had not become an independent working woman (yet)
So much of what season 9 set in motion was, to me, wonderful storytelling.....and unfortunately had to be abandoned....
Day Player
I actually liked the Parmalee/Jock storyline. It's impossible to replace Jim Davis in that role of course, but, Steve Forrest being from the same old school style as Davis was about as darn close as Dallas could have found. There was story there, if they had chose to go that way IMO. But, if I recall correctly Bobby returned with info from Punk Anderson which confirmed Parmalee was a fraud. Having learned so much Ewing info from a fever ridden and rambling Jock. Who apparantly while under the fever described the complete history of the Ewings
Aspiring soap scribe
I remember the story&personally believe he was Jock. As much as I adored Jim Davis as Jock&think he'd have been a hard act to follow I wish tptp hadn't backed away from Wes being revealed as Jock Ewing. I'm not sure how it would've affected Miss Ellie&Clayton's marriage(I hope they'd have weathered the storm)but an alive Jock would've provided intense drama.
One of the many reasons I believe Wes was Jock was the way Miss Ellie insisted Clayton&the boys just leave him in peace instead of hunting him down. I believe Wes told Miss Ellie that he was Jock when they were alone in SF during the annual BBQ. I don't know if he told her he couldn't stay(maybe he was terminal??)or he saw how torn she was between her feelings for him&Clayton but something happened that made him decide it best to leave. I think he asked Ellie not tell the family the truth. Wes knew if the boys knew "daddy" was alive they would have moved heaven&h&ll to get him back on SF.Jock loved Ellie&only wanted her to be happy. He knew she loved him but could also see how much she loved Clayton and how happy they were together. Jock,out of love for Ellie,didn't want to do anything to disrupt her life or cause her any unhappiness. Knowing Ellie would be devestated by having to choose between the two men she loved so dearly Jock decided to bow out.
(Just my thoughts on the story......I've had years&years&years to mull it over lol)
Last edited by dr.ivankipling; 02-14-2012 at 06:23 PM.
Soap Addict
Great thoughts....and if Dallas had continued on or been 'revived' closer to the original run (it's been 20 years...wow....) then this could have been a good storyline...that Ellie knew Wes was Jock, but he bowed and and just let things be as they were....and he could have come back again following Ellie's death....and revealed the truth....that he was Jock all along....
I think it's sort of sad that some of the actors from the original run are long since passed.....like Barbara Bel Geddes and Howard Keel,...even Steve Forrest....we still, thankfully, have most of the original cast still living...I just wish they ALL were around to see this new series and participate in it...
Aspiring soap scribe
Oh I would have loved seeing this story revisted.Heck I'd have loved having Dallas back sooner lol.
Wes coming back&revealing Miss Ellie had known he was Jock&kept silent would've rocked the Ewing world lol. I'm sure J.R. wouldn't have believed a word of it,even if Wes had a signed confession from Miss Ellie lol.
It's so hard to believe it's been 20 years since Dallas went off the air. Heck it hardly seems it's been 35-36 years since the show premiered.
Where in the world does the time go
Recurring Poster
I agree with most of this, however the part about “Wes knew if the JR and Bobby knew he daddy was alive they would try to get him back to SF part I have disagree. JR and Bobby refused to believe that Wes was Jock even though the X-rays and a lie detector test proved he could very well have been Jock (IMO proved he was Jock). Besides the bone structures being similar he had the same bullet wound that Jock had in the same area of his body from where that guy shot him on the hunting trip with the boys. I am not sure what would have convinced them he was a Jock, other than a total recall of his memory or maybe him remembering a conversation that he had with the boys or either one of them that even a rambling sick fevered Jock Ewing wouldn’t have told anyone. I mean he couldn’t have told Wes everything not every conversation and a “fake jock”would have to remember everything that was told to him and again I say a DNA test would have been good.
And another thing, I remember when bobby went down to South America and he was talking to that doctor and the doctor said Wes/Jock couldn’t remember who he was for the longest time then he woke up one day with tears in his eyes saying he remembered who he was and he said he is “Jock Ewing” his name was “Jock Ewing”. Now if he was a fraud he would have had to remember the information that the “real jock” told him (rambling and sick mind you) about his life and that would have been before he was in that hospital recovering.
Also, I personally don’t think he was terminal at least I don’t think so. I think he didn’t want to cause anymore pain/conflict with the family and Miss Ellie as you said and just left.
I remember Ray saying something to him in an earlier episode of the storyline like “I know what Jock would do I am curious to see if you do the same” or something to that effect.
Board Regular
This storyline was one of my favorites. However it had a very abrupt ending when suddenly Wes admitted he wasn't Jock after all then just vanished. I think it would have been more interesting to have made him really have been Jock.
Aspiring soap scribe
^^^^^^^^^^IA with you Link.
Board Regular
the parmalee story was really good - its a shame it ended how it did with him just disappearing and no explanation given by Miss Ellie
i think it would have been very interesting if he turned out to be Jock
but in a way am glad it didnt
Recurring Poster
I think it was left for the viewer to decide, deliberately presented ambiguously, even if the character claimed not to be Jock.
If they cast James Cromwell, we'll know this storyline is not dead.
he sure did have alot going for him to prove he was,but in my mind no-he would have never dealt with it in that way he would have wanted to save miss ellie from the hurt,he would have just talked to her and left,I think the writers were going on the fan responce to make up there minds,jock was a good character not perfect but good,but jim davis took it out of the ball park and when he died the jock character became bigger than ever and we will always miss him,he left way to soon.
Aspiring soap scribe
I've read had Patrick not returned as Bobby it would've been revealed Ben Stivers was indeed Jock Ewing. In season 10 Jock would have taken control of EO from J.R.
Scriptwriter
I guess I'm in the minority, but I didn't care for the s/l or for Steve Forrest as a possible Jock. Maybe with a different actor I would have liked it more. I've liked Forrest in other roles, but to me he just wasn't Jock. Regarding what the "real" Jock would have done, I disagree that he would have been willing to give up everything so easily and just walk away. I know he loved Ellie, but he also loved his kids and grand-kids, and he loved Ewing Oil. Naturally, it would have been very difficult to get his old life back, but the "real" Jock Ewing never backed away from a fight. So I was glad when Parmalee left.
HOWEVER, I wouldn't be surprised if this s/l is picked up again, maybe via an entry in Miss Ellie's diary, which I believe John Ross still has (or maybe he gave it back to J.R.). Now that Wes is gone, it would make an interesting s/l if Ellie had written in her diary all those years ago that she believed or was sure that Wes was, in fact, Jock. Imagine the dramatic possibilities here - JR and Bobby's reactions, their feelings about Ellie hiding the info from them, etc. etc. As always, JMHO.
Board Regular
If this storyline is picked up again and written well - it would be very interesting
but jock will be in his 90s if he was still alive
and I totally agree the real jock Ewing would never back down!
I Let My Evil Twin Post For Me
My thought always stood that if Wes was Jock, he wouldn't have let Clayton be Ellie's husband or the head of HIS family. I was never a fan of that storyline.
Board Regular
absolutely agree with you there - Jock was a winner and would no way have let anybody take what he thought was his!
How about an adult (male or female) showing up claiming to be a Ewing?? Age just a tad younger than Jon Ross or Christopher. A DNA test shows that he or she is a sibling to Bobby, Gary and JR. Proving that Wes was, in fact, Jock Ewing and fathered a child after leaving Ellie be with the settled life she had created after she & the family thought him dead.
Board Regular
Very plausible theory
to not bring back parmalee/jock physically
but to have a son or daughter who can prove they
Are his child via DNA
dna was not out in the original Dallas series
so this would be interesting
however if I'm honest I don't think they will bring back parmalee story
but who knows!
Scriptwriter
Jock wouldn't have to be alive. It might be more dramatic if he's not, because Bobby and J.R. would have to deal with their profound feelings of guilt over how they treated "Wes" and never had the chance to make amends or say good-bye to their father. Also, if it turns out that Ellie knew, I imagine they would initially be very angry with her for keeping this from them, and they'd have to wrestle with their anger w/o being able to talk to her about it. My guess is that Bobby would be more able to accept it eventually than JR. Bobby would probably say something like, "It's what Mama thought was best for all of us at the time."
Scriptwriter
Neither was I, midwest. And I agree, no way would Jock have let someone else be the head of his family.
Scriptwriter
I like this idea - it has lots of possibilities!
Board Regular
true! the guilt for both brothers would be hard! its a shame Ray is not in it the new series that much as he was also involved with Parmalee storyline and i remember one line Ray said to him was... ''i know what Jock would do/or would have done!''
Board Regular
haha i was watching one of the episodes today with Parmalee and when he meets JR after making his claim he is jock
and when JR see's him he greets him ''HELLLLO DAADDDDY''
I Let My Evil Twin Post For Me
I remember that scene from when I just watched the series from beginning to end.... The way Hagman delivered that line was GREAT!haha i was watching one of the episodes today with Parmalee and when he meets JR after making his claim he is jock
and when JR see's him he greets him ''HELLLLO DAADDDDY''
Aspiring soap scribe
I always believed that the storyline was dropped for two reasons:
1.) Viewers didn't really want Jock replaced by Steve Forrest.
2.) Bobby was brought back from the "dead". Oddy, Bobby didn't die because it was a dream.
At the time, I was annoyed with the whole storyline... because I thought the writers were so adamant on bringing Jock Ewing back from the dead - that they had to write Bobby's death as a dream.
I blamed the whole Bobby dream on the writers wanting to bring back Jock from the dead.
Now, looking back... I think storyline purposes would have been endless... with Jock back (and so many years had already passed since Jim Davies played Jock Ewing).
Steve Forrest had all the qualities that Jim Davies had.
Scriptwriter
I was one of those who did not want JD replaced by Steve Forrest. I still feel that way. I was not a fan of that s/l. But, as I said above, I could see the writers revisiting it now, with Jock gone and Bobby having to deal with the guilt if it turns out that Wes was, in fact, Jock Ewing. It's just so sad that JR won't be around to deal with it as well.
YR Ranger, imagine if that happens and VP returns as Pam - Bobby's life will be turned upside down!
Many of the crew and cast as well as many fans did not want them to recast Jock Ewing so they dropped the storyline. It would have made for some interesting storyline potential but I can see why they chose to drop it.
Board Regular
oh damn - he is only just left the world, but i miss him already!
and i totally agree, the way he delivered that line was just GREAT!
Board Regular
just looking back at this thread and now with JR going soon- this may be the time for some link to parmalee to turn up one day!! in the future
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